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Page 3
approued gentilnes, wil take it in good part. There as I
doo not folow ye latyn, woord for woord, for I omytte that
of a certaine set purpose.
_Your humile seruaunt, Philyppe_
Gerrard, groume of your
graces Chambre.
* * * * *
The interlocutours
{HEDONIVS} {SPVDEVS}
What meaneth hit _Spudeus_, too applye hys booke so
ernestlye I praye you what is the matter you murmour so with
yourselfe? _SPVDEVS._ The truth is (O _Hedoni_) I seke too
haue knowledge of a thing, but as yet I cannot fynde that
whych maketh for my purpose. _HEDO_ What booke haue you
there in your bosome? _SPVDE. Ciceros_ ||dialoge of the
endes of goodnes. _HEDO._ It had bene farre more better for
you, too haue sought for the begynnynges of godly thynges,
then the endes. _SPVDE._ Yea, but _Marcus Tullius_ nameth
that the ende of godlines which is an exquisite, a far
passing, and a very absolute goodnes in euerye puincte,
wherein there is contained all kynde of vertu: vnto the
knowledge ther of whosoeuer can attaine, shuld desire none
other th�g, but hold himselfe hauyng onely that, as one most
fully content and satisfied. _HED._ That is a worke of very
great learning and eloquence. But doo you thynke, that you
haue preuailed in any th�g there, whereby you haue the
||rather come too the knowledge of the truth? _SPE._ I
haue had such fruite and c�moditie by it, that now verelye
hereafter I shall doubt more of the effect and endes of good
thinges, then I did before. _HEDO._ It is for husb�d menne
too stande in doubt how farre the limittes and mereb�kes
extend. _SPE._ And I cannot but muse styll, yea, and wonder
very muche, why ther hath been so great controuersie in
iudgementes vpon so weightie a matter (as this is) emongist
so well learned menne: especially suche as bee most famous
and auncient writers. _HEDO._ This was euen the cause, where
the verite of a thyng is playne and manifest, c�trarily, ye
errour through || ignoraunce againe in the same, is soone
great & by diuers meanes encreaseth, for that thei knewe not
the foundation and first beginnyng of the whole matter, they
doo iudge at all auentures and are very fondly disceaued,
but whose sentence thynke you too bee truest? _SPE._ Whan
I heare _MARCVS Tullius_ reproue the thyng, I then f�tasie
none of all their iudgementes, and whan I heare hym agayne
defende the cause: it maketh me more doubtfull th� euer I
was and am in suche a studie, that I can say nothyng. But
as I suppose ye Stoickes haue erred the lest, and nexte vnto
th� I commend the _Peripatetickes_. _HEDo._ Yet I lyke none
of their opinions || so well as I doo the Epicures. _SPV._
And em�gist all the sectes: the _Epicures_ iudgement is most
reproued and condemned with the whole consent and arbitrem�t
of all menne. _HED._ Let vs laye a side all disdayne and
spite of names, and admitte the Epicure too bee suche one,
as euery man maketh of hym. Let vs ponder and weighe the
thyng as it is in very deed. He setteth the high and
principall felicitie of man in pleasure, and thiketh that
lyfe most pure and godly, whiche may haue greate delectati�
and pleasure, and lytle pensiuenes. _SPV._ It is euen so.
_HED._ What more vertuouser thyng, I praye you, is possible
too bee spok� then this || saiyng. _Spu._ Yea, but all menne
wonder and crye out on it, and saye: it is the voyce of a
bruite beast, and not of manne. _Hedo._ I knowe thei doo so,
but thei erre in ye vocables of theise thinges, and are very
ignoraunt of the true and natiue significations of the
woordes, for if wee speake of perfecte thynges, no kinde of
menne bee more righter _Epicures_, then Christen men liuing
reuer�tly towardes God and m�, and in the right seruice and
worshiping of Christ. _SPV_ But I thinke the _Epicures_ bee
more nerer and agree rather with the _Cynickes_, then with
the Christien sorte: forsoth ye Christiens make them selues
leane || with fastynge, bewayle and lament their offences,
and eyther they bee nowe poore, or elles theyr charitie and
liberalitie on the nedye maketh theim poore, thei suffer
paciently to bee oppressed of m�ne that haue great power and
take many wronges at their handes, and many men also laughe
theim too skorne. Nowe, if pleasure brynge felicitie wyth
it, or helpe in anye wyse vnto the furderaunce of vertue:
we see playnly that this kynde of lyfe is fardest from al
pleasures. _Hedonius._ But doo you not admitte _Plautus_ too
bee of authoritie? _Speudeus._ Yea, yf he speake vprightely.
_Hedonius._ Heare nowe them, and beare awaye wyth you the
saiynge of || an vnthriftie seruaunt, whyche is more wyttier
then all the paradoxes of the Stoickes. _SPE._ I tarie
to heare what ye wil say. _HEDO._ Ther is nothyng more
miserable then a mynd vnquiet & agreued with it selfe.
_SPE._ I like this saiyng well, but what doo you gather of
it? _HEDO._ If nothing bee more miserable th� an vnquiet
mynde, it foloweth also, that there is nothing happiar, then
a mynde voyde of all feare, grudge, and vnquietnes. _SPEV._
Surely you gather the thing together with good reas� but
that notwithstandynge, in what countrie shall you fynde any
such mynde, that knoweth not it selfe gyltie and culpable in
some kynde of euell, _HEDO._ || I call that euyll, whiche
dissolueth the pure loue and amitie betwixt God and manne.
_SPV._ And I suppose there bee verye fewe, but that thei bee
off�ders in this thynge. _HEDO._ And in good soth I take it,
that al those that bee purdged, are clere: whych wiped out
their fautes with lee of teares, and saltpeter of sorowfull
repentaunce, or els with the fire of charitie, their off�ces
nowe bee not only smalle grefe and vnquietnes too them, but
also chaunce oft� for some more godlier purpose, as causing
th� too lyue afterward more accordyngly vnto Gods
comma�dem�tes. _SPV._ In deede I knowe saltpeter and lee,
but yet I neuer hearde before, that faultes || haue been
purdged with fire. _H._ Surely, if you go to the minte you
shall see gould fyned wyth fyre, notwithst�dyng that ther
is also, a certaine kynde of lin� that brenneth not if it
bee cast in ye fyre, but loketh more whiter then any water
coulde haue made it, & therefore it is called _Linum
asbestinum_, a kynde of lynen, whyche canne neither bee
quenched with water nor brent with fyre. _Spu._ Nowe in
good faith you bring a paradox more w�derful then all the
maruailous and profound thynges of the Stoickes: lyue thei
pleasasauntly whom Chryst calleth blessed for that they
mourne & lament? _Hedonius._ Thei seme too the worlde too
mourne, but || verely they lyue in greate pleasure, and as
the commune saiynge is, thei lyue all together in pleasure,
in somuche that _SARDANAPALVS_, _Philoxenus_, or _Apitius_
compared vnto them: or anye other spoken of, for the greate
desyre and study of pleasures, did leade but a sorowefull
and a myserable lyfe. _Spe._ These thinges that you declare
bee so straunge and newe, that I can scarcelye yeoue any
credite vnto them. _Hedo._ Proue and assaye them ones, and
you shall fynde all my saiynges so true as the Gospell, and
immediatly I shal bryng the thynge too suche a conclusion
(as I suppose) that it shall appeare too differ very lytle
from the truth ||C.i|| _SPV._ make hast then vnto your
purpose. _HED._ It shalbe doone if you wyll graunt me
certayne thynges or I begynne. _Spu._ If in case you
demaunde suche as bee resonable. _Hedo._ I wyl take myne
aduauntage, if you confesse the thyng that maketh for mine
intent. _Spu._ go too. _Hedo._ I thynke ye wyll fyrste
graunt me, that ther is great diuersitie betwxt the solle
and the bodye _Spu._ Euen as much as there is betwene heauen
and yearth, or a thyng earthly and brute, & that whiche
dieth neuer, but alwayes c�taineth in it the godly nature.
_Hedo._ And also, that false deceiueable & co�terfetted holy
thynges, are not too bee taken for those, which in very dede
be || godly. _Spude._ No more then the shaddowes are too
bee estemed for the bodies, or the illusions and wonders of
wytchcraftes or the fantasies of dreames, are too bee taken
as true thynges. _HE._ Hitherto you answer aptly too my
purpose, and I thynke you wyl graunt me this thyng also,
that true and godly pleasure can reste and take place no
where but only on such a mynd that is sobree and honest.
_SPV._ What elles? for no man reioyseth too beholde the
Sunne, if his eyes bee bleared or elles delecteth in wyne,
if the agew haue infected hys tast. _HED._ And the _Epicure_
hymselfe, or elles I am disceiued, would not clippe &
enbrace that pleasure, whiche ||C.ii.|| would bring with
it farre greater payne and suche as would bee of long
continuaunce. _SPV_ I thynke he woulde not, if he had any
wytte at all. _HED._ Nor you wyll not denye this, that God
is the chiefe and especiall goodnes, then wh� there is
nothyng fayrer, there is nothyng ameabler, ther is nothing
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